Defences - Defence Line

I understand that when you pay for defences you also pay for, in certain circumstances the men, such as the mortar pit has 3 men and a mortar, but do the men start the game in the defences or do they have to come on as reinforcements from the table edge to take their position.

My view is that they would start the game in their positions and not have to try to take up positions from the table edge.

Jim.

Units on defences start the game on them.

Thank you for clarifying the rule.

Jim.

What Jim forgot to ask, as the game we were playing was an attack/defense game - the defenders had 2D6 units on board at start. I argues that the number thrown (around a nine I recall) included the units, like mortars and anti-tank rifle, that had been paid for as part of the army cost, so (say) 3 of the 9 were the units bought as part of a defense, whilst the remaining six were chosen from the remaining army pile.

Jim felt the rule was the other way around - that the pre-purchase units in the defenses were in addition to the rolled for starting units. As umpire, I felt that risked making the starting forces too strong.

But interested if there is an official rule.

Also, we had three objectives, that per that scenario had to be in the defenders middle portion of the table - hence all controlled, so I made the attackers draw three chits. But later reflection revealed that couldn't be right, as at that point the defender had an "all objectives secured" victory. So in those situations, how are objectives treated please?

Marc,

I don't agree, based on a couple of things.  First, if the defense you buy includes men and a gun, then it makes sense to me that they are deployed together.  Second, the language in the Defence Line scenario (page 76 of the new rule book) in para 3, Determine Initial Defenders, reads that you place defences first.  Later it says in addition to initial defences and units, you roll 2D6 and place other defenders.  

Of course, if your scenario included a surprise factor, then it might make sense that a mortar or MG team might have to hot-foot it to their position once the alarm is raised.

Regards

Mike

Units which are bought with defences, like the mentioned mortar team, and infantry in foxholes are deployed in addition to those rolled.
For example, you bought a HMG bunker, a mortar pit, a set of 10 foxholes, a fortified building and two trenchlines. Then you roll snake eyes (ouch!). You deploy the HMG team inside the bunker, the mortar team in the pit, and an Infantry sqaud in in the foxholes. In addition you may choose two other units. For example you choose one of your tanks and another infantry squad. The infantry might be deployed inside one of your remainig fortifications, but two of them will be empty. You will start with 5 units on the table. You might buy more fortifications, meaning you will start with more units, but as fortifications have no or only a low BR value, your force will be more fragile.

If as defender you hold all three objectives, then the attacker has to draw 3 chits. Remember that in most defensve scenarios the defender can not claim an "All objecteves held" victory. In my expierence the defender also draws a chit because he is out scouted, but this is not guaranteed. Maybe the defender has many snipers.....


Greetings
Wolflord

Thanks guys - great replies. Of course, it makes the attack tough but maybe that is the point. Next time we play it I will give the attackers a points bonus to give them some backbone. In our game, 500 points, the defenders rolled a 9 I think, so they were strongly on board to begin with, and the attackers only started the first few turns until reinforcements with 3 units. So it was a slow game, and teh defense saving throw made the defenders very tough. So we learned a lot

Hi
I have asked this before and got contradictory replies. Can the defender (who has just thrown snake eyes (as above))deploy say two vehicles with mounted crew or only one? Indeed this is relevant for the BG HQ, is this one unit on deployment or two.
Thanks in advance
Atkins

For deployment the transport vehicle and every passenger counts. So your FW HQ mounted on their transport would count as two units. Better to leave the transport vehicle off table to bring it forward later in the game.